Wood Sea Skiff ( diversion ). Back when life was more simple !
May 30 2008 at 11:36 AM
Paul (no login)
Here are some additional scans from the Robert DaPron collection. This is a mere scratch of the surface, and it takes time to scan this stuff, but it is way too good not to share!
I thought you fiberglass Commander fans would appreciate seeing some of the wood Chris Craft heritage that went into the design of your fiberglass boats. You will see many very fine details in these awesome wood boats, that ended up being replicated in some way in our fiberglass boats.
I am a previous wood Sea Skiff owner, having owned a beautiful 1968 35' Sea Skiff Clipper, see attached link for the article in Classic Boating Magazine where it was featured years ago. http://www.network54.com/Forum/424840/message/1125418703
And now.................on with the show !
This first image to start off the series, is from 1958, back when life was moving at a slower pace, and everything was a little more simple. No cell phones or blackberries to interrupt our day, and no computers either! Just good old fashioned wood working, varnish, and chrome plated brass. The 40' boat was described as "The mighty 40-ft, Semi-Enclosed Cruiser. Rugged offshore boat designed for the waters you'll encounter on extended cruises. Sleeps 6. Twin engines only, including diesel."
The following image and write-up were included as the PHOTO OF THE DAY, back on June 1, 2008.
Many fiberglass Commander owners today got their start as children aboard wood Chris Craft boats, and many of us have or still do own wood Chris Crafts. Chris Craft played a big role in the history of cruiser development, taking the four elements of galley, head, convertible dinette, and convertible sofa, and combining them into many efficient configurations within a 10 to 14 beam. A V-berth generally terminated the front of the cabin on most of the models.
Over the years helm stations varied from one side to another for no apparent reason. Most often we find Commanders with their helm station on the port side, and some of the Sedan and Sport Fisherman models have the lower helm stations located along the centerline of the boat. Our early model Commander interiors, however, are near identical duplicates from the historic layouts of the 1930s, 1940s, 1950s and early 1960s. The initial series of 38 Commander Express, for instance, is a near identical interior layout to many wood cruisers Chris Craft built in previous years. It is a tried and true design, offering a sofa immediately upon entering the cabin, a handy galley for placing groceries and supplies immediately onto the counter and into the refrigerator, and a head located more forward to be adjacent to the V-berth in case it was needed at night. This formula was refined over and over again on many boats, and when the fiberglass Commander came along, it was a natural to continue the designs.
When the later series Commanders evolved, interior design took a more modern twist. This is the case in the 36, 42, and 45 Commander Tournament Fisherman models, for instance, where the interiors are full open with tall glass all the way around. Even that technique was used, at least in part, on some of the older wood Chris Craft models.
The boat shown here as the Photo of the Day today, is just one example out of thousands, showing some Chris Craft history, and a part of it exists in our Commanders today. This particular boat is a 1960 40 Sea Skiff Hardtop Cruiser, and it weighed in at around 17,000 pounds, had 550-hp and would run at 30-mph back in 1960. I personally find everything about this boat to be very well done except the front section of the hull, and that should have been finished in the more traditional pointed bow, rather than the gill-like frontal upturn. Had they finished the bow differently, this could have been one of their most desirable models. As it turned out, this model ran its own course, and there are actually a rare few of these still in existence, probably most of them being in the Lake St. Clair area.
The point in showing this particular boat, along with a series of other Sea Skiff models of the 1950 and 1960s, is to give us a reference point. It is also representing the status of Chris Craft at the time they were acquired by NAFI, National Automotive Fibers, Inc., in 1962. This is the very time when Dick Avery came on board at Chris Craft and began work on many of the wood models, and eventually had a lot of personal impact on many Chris Craft Commanders (and other models too) later in the 1960s and 1970s. This is also the very time frame when Mac Mackerer was finishing up the soon to be released 1964 38 styled in fiberglass Commander. When you look at the Sea Skiff line in the following link, remember these boats were being produced simultaneously when our first Commanders first hit the showroom floors. They were built along side many other wood models, like the Constellations, for instance. All of the wood boats in the Chris Craft lineup suddenly became obsolete, and they all disappeared during the next ten year time frame when fiberglass swept the industry. Many of these beautiful and curious wood cruisers still exist, and they are a direct historical link to the design of our fiberglass cruisers.
Check out the following link for a glimpse into the 1960 Chris Craft Sea Skiff lineup, back when the pace of life was slower, and times were more simple, without cell phones, satellite TV, and computers.
A look at the 1960s wood Sea Skiff lineup, reveals many design features carried over to our fiberglass Commanders !
This message has been edited by FEfinaticP on Jun 2, 2008 12:06 PM
Realizing these boats were being sold along side fiberglass Commanders, they still represented a lot of boat, a great value, and a superb style and tradition of their own.
The Chris Craft styling department, engineering, and manufacturing plant worked very hard to maintain a design continuity between various Chris Craft models, whether they were built of wood, metal, or fiberglass. This is one good looking open boat. It reminds me a lot of the fiberglass 31' Sports Express, being sold along side (at a much higher cost, no doubt).
Twin 185 or 210-hp V8 engines were available, with speeds to 34-mph. Weight was way down to 10,500 - 10,900 pounds. I know how one of thes would handle, my 35' Sea Skiff Clipper of 1968 weighed in at 12,000 pounds, with a pair of 210-hp 327F motors, and it was the fastest cruiser in our yacht club at the time.
I have been aboard one of these, and they are massive. With big diesel power and light weight wood construction, one of these would run off and leave just about everything else it's size, and it would do so with ease. The upper station is huge, and what a fun boat this would have been. Not many left.
Here is a true sport fishing machine, complete with fishing chairs, lower aft deck that was also incorporated into the fiberglass version of this boat ( 38' Commander Sport Fisherman ) . Note the absence of an aft rail just like the 38 Commander SF.
This 38, however, weighing in at 16,000 pounds, and offered with twin 210 or 275-hp motors, was able to achieve speeds of 34-mph. Even by todays standards, that is a fast cruiser this size. Can you imagine having one of these neew boats sitting at the slip, with a pair of big block Lincolns, on a pretty morning ready to head out and do some salt water fishing? It must have been nice!
How's this for a comparable photo ( below ) ???
This is our fiberglass 38' Commander Sport Fisherman.
Here is a 1967 image of the 38' Commander Sport Fisherman, hmmm, you don't suppose that's the same fish, ha!
I like the posts on wood boats. Especially the lapstrake boats. Good thing Lyman Boat Works came up with a design so other boat builders could copy them. LOL Running for cover now!!!!!
I grew up just south of Lake Erie, at Conneaut Lake, Pennsylvania. I don't recall ever seeing the first Lyman or Sea Skiff on Conneaut Lake, but Lake Erie was full of them. They had such a distinct shape, windshield, and character, it was something I associated with Lake Erie. Now of course, I can't remember whether I was actually seeing a Lyman or CC Sea Skiff, or perhaps some other builder who was replicating the popular "sea skiff" design. Hutchinson built some nice ones too.
Glad you liked the post, I have reams of this stuff, and from time to time I'll add some other Sea Skiff models.
That was a real treat. Thanks, Paul!
Having grown up here on Lake St. Clair, I've had the pleasur of being on every one of these boats over the years! There are still at least one of every one of these models still running here on the lake! There is even a late 50's boat like that semi-enclosed, with the distinctive forward cabin top that blends into the foredeck... but it's an open boat (no hard top or bridge). A very unique and dramatic design! Those big 30+ Sea Skif Sport Cruisers are some of my all-time favorite boats... I've had the opportunity to knock down some pretty big chop in a couple of those in days gone by. Very fond memories, indeed.
I love my Commander, but I also love the CC heritage, and this is something I could not have found anywhere else. It just gives me an additional appreciation for my fiberglass rendition of the same thing.
This is a nice break from the steady diet of fiberglass, and it sure takes me back in time. These Sea Skiff boats were never really built to last as long as they have. There are a fair number of them left, but they are disappearing every year. It is good to know there are pockets in the country where they are still revered and maintained, like the Lake St. Clair area. We used to have a lapstrake cruiser here at our marina, but it has not been seen for at least three years, and I doubt if it will be back. It was probably hauled off, parted out, and burned, which is a sad end to such a joyful use of wood. I think the trailerable boats should last a while longer as there is a pretty solid appreciation for them at boat shows, and they can be maintained in a shop. The cruisers that must be repaired on the yard, demand someoneone who knows how to work on a wood hull, and that is getting more rare and more expensive every day.
Nice thread, it was an enjoyable way to spend part of the morning with a cup of coffee.
We had a big diesel powered Corinthian here in our part of the Gulf a few years ago. It raised tons of fish, looked good doing it too. It was always kept in great condition. It was sold to a guy from Gulfport. Maybe someone in that area knows the boat?
I have not seen one of the big lapstrake cruisers on the water for quite some time. They were great boats. There are still a few of the smaller ones here and there. The comment about the smaller ones lasting longer is very true. If you can get them on a trailer, they are always better cared for than the ones that sit in the water all the time. These days, putting a new bottom on one of those big boats and doing it the right way, will cost a big chunk of change!
In the mid 1990s we had a 28ft. Sea Skiff Express cruiser with a single 327. It was a nice boat with dry bilges, good fuel economy and nice cabin room. The boat could be a handful in a following sea though, I remember coming home from Put-in-Bay one year in 4-5 footers with the soft chine and small keel, we would surf and skate down the face of every wave. I must have spun that helm from one side to the other a thousand times on that trip.
Our next boat was a 32ft. connie, one of the prettiest wooden boats made by chris craft. Now we have a 38 Commander express FXA 38 2033R. We enjoyed all of the boats the express cabin design is ideal for cruising with two people, but when I think of how small the cabin was on the 28 Skiff, I don't know how we did all of the trips we did
We had a somewhat similar experience with a 1968 Sea Skiff
June 1 2008, 11:01 AM
Great story Bob, we had a similar experience with wood Chris Crafts before we went for a 38' Express. Our 1968 35' Sea Skiff Clipper had an almost identical layout to our Commander. It was spooky walking inside the Commander, it reminded us so much of the Skiff, but everything was a little larger, etc. The Commander was a LOT heavier than the Skiff.
We bought our Commander before we sold the Skiff, because the deal showed up and we took it. I got a chance to drive them both, and the Skiff at 12,000 pounds felt light weight and nimble, while the the Commander felt like a barge by comparison. As I learned more about the Commander I understood more what that feel was all about. The cushion design of the hull, the lifting strakes, the semi V design, etc., and yes, the added weight.
The 38 Commander actually handles very well.
The Skiff by comparison, even though they made big diesel powered boats, was like an egg shell. Very fragile by comparison. When I had mine on the lift, it wanted to pinch the hull inward. I thought it was going to break glass at the forward windshield. I had to use a spreader bar.
If you ever hit something bad with the Skiff and broke a plank out, you better know where the life jackets are because you are going down. I dare say, there are Skiffs on the bottom now, that have experienced that very event. Even though they were light weight, the overall hull was strong enough and resilient enough to take heavy seas. I don't think they could have taken a serious impact. The 38 Commander by comparison, if it hit the same object that could sink a Skiff (like a floating log) you could probably just buff it out of the gelcoat. The Commander by comparison is built like a bank vault.
The Skiffs were always lower cost alternatives, but they offered big boating pleasure and lots of style and fun. when it came to style, they sure had a look all their own. I would not rule out getting another one in the future, but it will have to be one that I can get on a trailer. Looking through the scans here allready (and I have a ton more I can add later) I see a couple nice Express models that would be a blast for entertaining on the Cumberland River "Alan Jackson style".
The Skiff design is following a traditional cabin, windshield, trim, hardware, helm, power, layout, and general philosophy that is also carried over onto the Constellation, Roamer, Commander, Catalina, and some of the other lines too. Chris Craft sure had a dynasty "back then".
Lumber going in one end of the shop, boats like these coming out the other end. Those were the days. There are shops around the country where wood boats are still being built, but I don't know of anyone doing lapstrake boats.
Chris Craft seemed to make a science out of building a lapstrake hull, and their Thiokol caulking just made them better. It must have been tremendously rewarding for the craftsmen to be able to see these beautiful hulls start from nothing, and end up coming out of the shop looking so pretty.
