I have a 65 and 66 T-Bird I run 160 thermostats in them. Radiators have been check for flow and are good. I want to put the best fan for cooling. I currently have 7 blade clutch fans. What is better a non thermal or thermal clutch fan for cooling at idle? hOW DOES THE NON THERMAL One work? Is a flex fan the way to go? Thanks for any input
Definitely get a better water pump. A 1966 stock water pump should be replaced with something a little "higher performance". Go with an aftermarket pump to increase the flow.
Lot of good info on cooling, Thanks. So it seems that the non thermal fan clutch would only lock up at a higher rpm and when your at idle it would turn less, Do i have that right?
Having that huge heavy thing hanging off the water pump and not spinning in time with engine never appealed to me. When they quit the thing doesn't cool real well.
A flex fan properly sized always works. I've had great luck with just a flex fan with no shrouds, huge rad or electric helpers.
Have and much prefer a standard (not a HD) thermal clutch fan for longevity and the fact that it doesn't draw down much top end hp as it freewheels at speed. Electric fans are fine for many but....have never had a clutch fan under, oh, say, 100,000+ miles ever let me down!
Note that only the electric fan beat the std. thermal clutch and not by much. See however how many hp the flex fans ate up....yikes!
This message has been edited by machoneman on Dec 10, 2008 6:16 PM This message has been edited by machoneman on Dec 10, 2008 6:13 PM
Seems to answer 2 unasked question about these High horsepower 4 and 6 cylinder engines to
December 11 2008, 8:39 AM
Almost all the newer engines use electric fans. The obvious reason for some of the front wheel drive cars is due to the transverse mounted engines (meaning mounted east to west instead of north to south as it is on most rear wheel drive cars).
One of the other benefits is what is noted in the article. An electric fan doesn't draw (drain) even half as much horsepower as a belted, engine driven fan. Second being easier packaging for the designers. No longer limited by having a clear path to exhausting (radiator) heat from under the hood, they can lower the front end profile of the car, making it more aerodynamic - resulting in needing less horsepower to acheive better fuel economy, adequet heat transfer and giving an and added freebie ... higher top end speed.
But then; we knew that already.
Personally, I still prefer a belt driven fan for street cars. Like mentioned above.... the chances of a belt driven fan/water pump leaving you stranded compared to an electric water pump/fan are more than I really want to take, if it really is a street driven, daily driver type car. The extra horsepower that is lost, is one of the compromises I'm willing to make.
This message has been edited by beoweolf on Dec 11, 2008 8:46 AM
although I agree we kinda' knew all that....it's still worth mentioning. Although the transverse mount virtually eliminates a belt driven fan, some N-S mounted engine/body combos also use electric fans. In the drive to maximize fuel mileage, that extremely low hp loss had been mighty attractive to auto designers/engineers. Hey, face it, in a say 150 hp engine saving the 5-6 hp extra that even a std. thermal clutch fan sucks up compared to an electric is a pretty fair % of savings. The % drops substantially though in my almost 500 hp 351W (sorry, no FE's here anymore...sad to say).
One other factor is cost. I'd hate to lose my 'Stangs engine to a failed relay, electric motor, sensor etc. as it would cost me a bunch more to replace it than my Nissan's daily driver 4 cylinder, for sure!
This message has been edited by machoneman on Dec 11, 2008 8:58 AM
...about the reason that the OEMs use electric fans. But if you will notice, practically all cars started using them in the mid-'90's whether they had sideways engines or not. The reason being you can get the motor to temp faster, thereby getting it into closed loop opperation for emissions. If the fan does not come on until a pre-determined temp, it heats up very rapidly. This has many benefits for hot rods as well. It makes the engine less "cranky" sooner, evaporates the condensation from the crankcase sooner, and gets the oil flowing through the engine earlier in the running time.
As far as failure of electrical components goes, shit happens. In my experiance, if you actually use OEM components (as opposed to aftermarket "hot rod" stuff) such as relays, temp sensors, and fans, failure is QUITE rare. I use Volvo stuff with a GM temp sensor. I have used Taurus and Lincoln LS fans also.
You get what you pay for. I am jinxing myself here but the pickup coil in my truck Duraspark came out of a junkyard 400 OEM, 1978. The aftermarket replacement let me down in a week. Pulled that one out of a parts dizzy, and 9 years of reliable service. It scares me to death to know what I'll probably have to replace it with someday. Just tuned it up day before yesterday. O'Reillys best was Chinese reference Standard Motor Products. Cap, rotor, plugs (Autolite 45s is all they had) and wires all made in China hpefully except for the plugs but who knows. The only thing brass in the whole deal was the rotor tip and the coil side of the coil wire. I gapped them down to .035 and had to dress the rotor, hopefully they will hold up. It really sucks.
had any luck with electric fans. I have tried pushers, pullers, both, with & without custom made shrouds. Just will not keep it cool. Bolt the old 6 blade paddle back on with factory shroud & all is well again.
of use on my aftermarket electric fan. Vehicle is a '63 F-100 that originally had a six in it. Rad is original, and when I bought the truck, it had a '64 390 PI engine in it. It also had a plastic flex fan and occasionally it would get hot. Obviously the fan was only for decoration since it was about six inches from the rad and there was no shroud. I put an electric fan on, and only use a toggle switch for control. Works just fine---when daily driving, I only need it about once a week. I glance at the temp gauge when traffic is holding me up. I usually turn it on at about 200 and it drops right back to the 180 that usually shows. You can see it fall. The fan has the blades connected by a somewhat rudimentary ring that sorta acts as a shroud. It's mounted as a puller. That's the most efficient way. JMO
KS
