Hi, John McKee sent me some additional engine photos on that 23' Commander that has been sitting outside near him in Butte Montana -- this boat:
I had asked him to see if he could get a view where the cross bolts for the mains would show -- he said he did the best he could. I can't tell from his pictures, so thought I would post them for you guys to look at. Below the photos, I comment on firing order.
Regarding firing order: On the original photos that John posted, there was a discussion on this forum noting the firing order cast onto the intake manifold was different than that shown on the ID plate on the exhaust manifold. My comment is that both are correct firing orders for 427 engines. The one on the intake is for a normal rotation engine, and the one on the exhaust is for a reverse rotation engine. So the question is, which rotation is this engine? Someone may have picked up parts or all of a reverse rotation engine and installed it/them in this boat.
Anyway, have at it guys. John said he is sure the guy would take $1000. And John said he could help get the boat moved to a storage yard if one of you wants to buy it and come get it later. If that is a 427, it is a heck of a deal.
Best wishes, Curt...
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1967 fiberglass 38' Chris Craft Commander Sportfisher with twin 427 CID 300 HP engines.
Great pics Curt, thanks. Something's got my attention though, do you see any cross bolts? I don't. I'm looking but I don't see any sign of a crossbolt?
The 428 is an externally balanced motor, not sure about the 390. They all LOOK exactly the same on the outside except for the tell-tale cross bolts on the 427 and a very few of the 406 motors.
I'm thinking this was a factory swap or an individual who may have worn out the 427 and simply bolted on all the marine equipment, which would fit onto the 390 or the 428 nicely (or a 352 for that matter).
You'll note my early questions about the intake on this motor, as it did not look like the typical marine 427, and it actually suggested to me it might be something with less power as the intakes looked smaller. It could be a FT motor (truck motor) in which case it would be very strong with a forged steel crankshaft, but not really any stronger in marine use than the very fine cast iron 427 crank.
Interesting animal the guy has out there in Montana. I don't think it's a 427 though. Would still be a great boat if it runs, with a big ole motor like that.
The Montana boat has had a transplant? You're right about the manifold - is that a 2-barrel? Sure isn't Chris-Craft blue, and no decals - and what are those valve covers from?
........I'm wondering if CC sold the 428 as a 427, or if they just listed it as a 300 hp engine. It wouldn't be the first time, becuase "MOST" of the 427 Cobras that were sold as 427s were actually powered by the 428, which was a less expensive motor (but it would still burn rubber all the way down the block). Ford (and Shelby) had a rebate program set up to refund money in the event someone came into the showroom after discovering the car they thought had the real NASCAR bruiser actually had a hot sedan motor that LOOKED just like the 427. The 428 was a longer stroke and smaller bore motor, a good one, but it would never be competitive on the race tracks like the better breathing and more race ready 427 was. I think all of the competition Cobras were 427s.
In any case, putting a 428 into a boat would make a lot of sense, they were strong and had great torque. In any case, I have my doubts about this one being a 427.
There are some claims out there about some 2-bolt 427s being built for "industrial" use, but they are so rare that they're actually considered to be non-existant. I know of a guy who claims to have one. Jury is still out.
Paul
This message has been edited by FEfinaticP on Jul 28, 2006 5:30 PM
Of the externally balanced Ford big blocks of the era, only the FT, 428 and 410 (the latter only offered in 1966 and 67, essentially a 390 with a 428 crank) were externally balanced. Since the 428 and 410 were performance oriented, I think the manifold on this one suggests it's a FT (truck) motor.
This conclusion is after two beers and thinking about it while watching the evening news, lol.
The intake, if it's actually a part of the rest of the motor and not a swap, suggests it's a lower horsepower higher torque motor as found in lots of pickup and delvery trucks of the era.
